# Parentheses Fuzz: Popping when Distortion or Boost engaged



## jeffwhitfield (Jan 3, 2022)

Ok, folks...interesting little quirk with my Parentheses Fuzz builds. Basically, a pop is heard when the foot switch for either the Distortion or Boost is clicked. Distortion is much worse than the Boost. Usual fixes don't seem to work. Tried a 10k and 1M resistors on the input and output to ground. So, now I'm thinking that it's something else inherent in the circuit itself.


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 3, 2022)

One thing I'm wondering...would adding buffers to the Distortion and Boost switches work? I'm looking at the C-Buffer boards and wondering if adding those would do the trick...or would that not make any difference.


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## carlinb17 (Jan 3, 2022)

Could it be a problem with using a breakout board? Do you hear it when you engage the octave (distortion has to be on first)


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 3, 2022)

Don’t hear it with the octave switch. Hmm…why would a breakout board cause problems? I’ll try it but that does sound like an odd possibility.


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## benny_profane (Jan 3, 2022)

Does having the Octave engaged/disengaged make any difference? Also, what LEDs are you using?


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 3, 2022)

benny_profane said:


> Does having the Octave engaged/disengaged make any difference? Also, what LEDs are you using?


Nope, octave doesn't make any difference. Actually makes it worse when engaged. As for LED's, I'm using a standard red one from Tayda as well as green and yellow for the others.

I took out the red one to test. Pop is still there even without the LED in.


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## carlinb17 (Jan 3, 2022)

If you have another switch you could eliminate that question by wiring up one without a breakout board


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 3, 2022)

Yeah, might as well. Just seems odd that a breakout board would cause this. I do have a few other pedals with similar issues. Seems that the issue lies in the fact that many of these circuits don't have buffers and tend to be susceptible to impedance changes when engaging with certain switches. Could very well just be the damn switches I'm using.


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## Barry (Jan 3, 2022)

Check for any DC leakage from the electrolytic caps


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 4, 2022)

Ok, so I tried a stand-alone switch without the breakout and even tried an alternative layout that uses a 470k resistor to bleed things off with the switch. Seems to have improved it a bit...but the pop is still there. I'm starting to think it might just be the quality of the switches themselves. Put in an order for better switches so I guess we'll see. 

I still wonder if a buffer on the switch will help. Or maybe a relay? Thoughts?


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## giovanni (Jan 4, 2022)

Where did you get the switches?


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## benny_profane (Jan 4, 2022)

I think the more likely issue is going to be leaky electrolytics causing a DC potential (as @Barry said) rather than the switches themselves. That alternate layout is simply adding a pull-down resistor at the output. Since that improved things, it seems like leakage might be an issue. I’d suggest investigating that next.


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## Kroars (Jan 4, 2022)

carlinb17 said:


> Could it be a problem with using a breakout board? Do you hear it when you engage the octave (distortion has to be on first)


I’ve used the breakout boards for the boost and bypass for the 6 or so I’ve built and haven’t had a popping issue.  Not much help, I know, but I think it’s safe to rule those out.


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 4, 2022)

Alright, so, after researching this a bit and trying a few things out, here's what I've found...

Quick fixes don't work primarily because the issue isn't what I thought it was. Typically, if you're getting a pop on the first click but not subsequent clicks then it usually points to a capacitor issue...but I don't think that's what's going on here. Simply changing out capacitors isn't likely to eliminate the pop. Fact that it's doing this on other pedals as well as the Parentheses means it's not a simple issue. This is a very common issue and isn't easily fixed within the pedal itself, regardless of whether it has a buffer, certain capacitors, and whatnot. 

Here's what's weird...I tested a bunch of different pedals I own including some commercial ones. All of them exhibited an audible pop when engaging: an MXR distortion pedal, EHX Glove, even a Boss JB-2 (which is known to have a really good buffer)...all of them have audible pops. The Boss JB-2 even exhibited a bit of microphonics. When engaged, tapping on the pedal could be heard with reverb on. Weird!

The one that didn't pop was an EQD Astral Destiny. The reason is that it uses an electronic bypass relay switch rather than a mechanical switch.

So, yeah, turns out pretty much any pedal with a mechanical switch is subject to this issue. However....there are ways to minimize the pop.

I use a TC Electronic Sentry for my noise gate and run all my drives through it. When it's engaged and set properly for the drives attached none of the same pedals exhibit a pop. So, on top of tamping down noise, seems it also does an excellent job in keeping pops from being heard when pedals are engaged. That works when things are silent so you might still hear a pop while still playing. Not much can be done about that so you might need to engage at the right time to minimize any pop.

So, yeah, I think the easy answer is: for pedals that have a noticeable pop, good caps, and proper pulldown resistors, adding a noise gate into the mix can help tamp down on the remaining pop issue. TC Electronic Sentry is my pick mainly cause it has a Send and Return loop to help further reduce noise based on what's coming in the Input. Mileage may vary but, honestly, I think this is the best answer in this case.

I did order some better switches to see if that helps in minimizing the pop. My guess is that a softer switch will minimize any microphonic issues with the click of the switch itself introducing a pop in the signal. Gonna do that as an experiment and go from there.


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 4, 2022)

giovanni said:


> Where did you get the switches?


From StompBoxParts. They had a sale on some soft click switches. Pretty much on par with LoveMySwitches and the like.


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## benny_profane (Jan 4, 2022)

Are you hearing a pop or the mechanical click from the bypass? Some of that doesn't seem to add up. The Boss pedal uses JFET switching and is more akin to the relay-based switching in that there is no mechanical element in the signal path. Good point about the easy capacitor check. 

What are you using to power the pedal?


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 4, 2022)

benny_profane said:


> Are you hearing a pop or the mechanical click from the bypass? Some of that doesn't seem to add up. The Boss pedal uses JFET switching and is more akin to the relay-based switching in that there is no mechanical element in the signal path. Good point about the easy capacitor check.
> 
> What are you using to power the pedal?


I think it is the mechanical click of the switch to some degree. And, yeah, doesn't 100% add up. I'm thinking it has more to do with impedance changes. 

I use a Voodoo Pedal Power 3 and an X4 extender as well. I did try and isolate a pedal using a stand-alone power supply. Still has the same issue.

They do all get run through an HX Stomp. I have two of them and both of them exhibit the same issue. Even if I run a pedal as one of the first things in the chain the pop can still be heard. So, yeah, there's more to this than meets the eye. Gonna experiment more to see what else I can surmise.


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## giovanni (Jan 4, 2022)

What happens if you skip the HX stomp?


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## music6000 (Jan 5, 2022)

jeffwhitfield said:


> Alright, so, after researching this a bit and trying a few things out, here's what I've found...
> 
> Quick fixes don't work primarily because the issue isn't what I thought it was. Typically, if you're getting a pop on the first click but not subsequent clicks then it usually points to a capacitor issue...but I don't think that's what's going on here. Simply changing out capacitors isn't likely to eliminate the pop. Fact that it's doing this on other pedals as well as the Parentheses means it's not a simple issue. This is a very common issue and isn't easily fixed within the pedal itself, regardless of whether it has a buffer, certain capacitors, and whatnot.
> 
> ...


Check that you don't have a bad Patch Cable, usually the one that gets Tugged & Plugged alot????


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 5, 2022)

So, I skipped the HX Stomp and hooked up a few pedals directly to a different amp I have for mobile use, a Line 6 Spyder V. Most of the commercial ones don't exhibit a pop really. But many of the ones I've built, including the Parentheses, still do. No common denominator just yet so I'll need to examine the pedals a bit to see why. I'm still leaning on the problem being the switches themselves. Seems that good soft click ones are way less prone to microphonic pops that heavier ones...especially cheap switches. Have to admit that many of my builds don't always have the most expensive switches in them. That could be the source of my problems. 

That said, it's less a problem for me and more of a problem for folks buying pedals from me. If they're using them live then, yeah, a pop is a problem.


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## jeffwhitfield (Jan 3, 2022)

Ok, folks...interesting little quirk with my Parentheses Fuzz builds. Basically, a pop is heard when the foot switch for either the Distortion or Boost is clicked. Distortion is much worse than the Boost. Usual fixes don't seem to work. Tried a 10k and 1M resistors on the input and output to ground. So, now I'm thinking that it's something else inherent in the circuit itself.


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## ColorMeBaddFann (Nov 4, 2022)

Any luck on the boost & distortion switch popping on the Parentheses builds? Finished mine a few days ago and experiencing the same result. Figured I'd ask around.


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## music6000 (Nov 4, 2022)

jeffwhitfield said:


> Ok, folks...interesting little quirk with my Parentheses Fuzz builds. Basically, a pop is heard when the foot switch for either the Distortion or Boost is clicked. Distortion is much worse than the Boost. Usual fixes don't seem to work. Tried a 10k and 1M resistors on the input and output to ground. So, now I'm thinking that it's something else inherent in the circuit itself.
> 
> View attachment 20768


A dry Solder joint can cause the Pop


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## jeffwhitfield (Nov 6, 2022)

For my builds, I used switches with no more than a 35oz touch. Stiffer switches make the pop way more pronounced. I couldn’t fully get rid of it though.


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## music6000 (Nov 6, 2022)

jeffwhitfield said:


> For my builds, I used switches with no more than a 35oz touch. Stiffer switches make the pop way more pronounced. I couldn’t fully get rid of it though.


I thought you were having an Issue with one Build.
EQD pedal designs seem to have a ''Pop'' issue!?
Have you tried 10k from OUTPUT to GND on Footswitch Pads:


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## mdc (Nov 6, 2022)

If using the same amp consistently, check for DC leak coming from the amp?
Something with the power supply in your house? LED lights/dimmers on the same circuit? Too close to a computer monitor?


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## jeffwhitfield (Nov 7, 2022)

music6000 said:


> I thought you were having an Issue with one Build.
> EQD pedal designs seem to have a ''Pop'' issue!?
> Have you tried 10k from OUTPUT to GND on Footswitch Pads:
> 
> View attachment 35433


I noticed that pretty much all my builds had that problem. Seemed to be more pronounced with the heavier switches. This is good suggestion, especially after updating them to use lighter weight switches. Might even make the pop virtually inaudible.

Granted, a noise gate does fix the problem. No pop whatsoever with my noise gate on.


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