# Paragon squealing/whistling noises with high volume/gain/tone settings - normal?



## Loetlurch (Aug 13, 2020)

Hey,

I just built a Paragon (side one standard, side two high gain) out of a kit I ordered from dasmusikding.de which works fine and sounds great. When I dial in very (!) high volume, tone and gain settings and engage both sides together it starts making loud squealing/whistling noises which change a bit when turning the knobs. If I dial back the tone knobs to zero it stops. This is without a Guitar plugged in. 

When I plug in a Guitar in and leave its volume on zero it doesn't make noises even with everything on full. (!?) A soon as I start to turn the volume on the Guitar it starts making noises again. It stops while playing notes. 

If I use the pedal with more "normal" settings, there's no problem at all. 

I've checked the solder joints and the wiring several times. I interchanged the 4580 ICs. I tried a battery instead of a power supply. I varied the location of the pedal in the room. I tried it with the housing closed and opened. Before I soldered them in, I measured every resistor. I knocked on the parts with a wooden pencil and checked if they're all tight on the board. Nothing changed. 

Is this behaviour normal? If not, what could it be? I've read in another thread, that sometimes a charge pump can cause noises. Could this be the problem? Why does it stop, when a Guitar with volume on zero is plugged in. Impedance on the input?

Greetings
Michael


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## Loetlurch (Aug 16, 2020)

Doesn't anyone have any idea what might be causing the problem? 

I noticed another strange thing: when there is a buffered (!) pedal in the chain before the Paragon, it doesn't squeal or whistle.  

For those of you who have already built a Paragon: How does your Pedal react, when you put everything on 10?

Greetings 
Michael


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## Robert (Aug 16, 2020)

Try to spread out the wires that connect the two boards together.


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## Loetlurch (Aug 16, 2020)

Thank you! 

I tried it and it doesn't change anything. 

Is my Paragon the only one, that does that?

Greetings 
Michael


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## Loetlurch (Aug 17, 2020)

This is what it sounds like when you dial in high gain and volume settings:


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## caiofilipini (Aug 17, 2020)

miczyk said:


> Is my Paragon the only one, that does that?



Not really sure what's going on with yours (just watched the video), but I just wanted to say that I built two Paragons and didn't have this issue in neither. I'll leave it to the experts to help you track down the cause. Good luck!


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## Loetlurch (Aug 17, 2020)

caiofilipini said:


> Not really sure what's going on with yours (just watched the video), but I just wanted to say that I built two Paragons and didn't have this issue in neither. I'll leave it to the experts to help you track down the cause. Good luck!



Good to know. Thank you!

Can you turn all the controls up to the max without that happening? 

Greetings
Michael


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## Robert (Aug 17, 2020)

The Paragon is one of the oldest projects here, I don't recall ever hearing of this happening before.


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## Nostradoomus (Aug 17, 2020)

You definitely want to make the connections between the switch board and the main board as short as possible, most people seem to use headers here with good results.


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## zgrav (Aug 17, 2020)

Was the sound the same regardless of whether it was in the enclosure or outside of the enclosure?


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## Nostradoomus (Aug 17, 2020)

Also maybe try hooking up a battery to it, could be your power supply


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## Boba7 (Aug 17, 2020)

It seems normal to me, a lot of circuits with gain and volume maxed will squeal, especially if they’re stacked and they’re not properly buffered.

The real question is: will you ever use both channel with full gain and volume at the same time? If not, no problem!


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## Barry (Aug 17, 2020)

I've built two, a full and a mini, never had that issue, but probably never have or ever will push them to those limits


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## Loetlurch (Aug 21, 2020)

Nostradoomus said:


> You definitely want to make the connections between the switch board and the main board as short as possible, most people seem to use headers here with good results.



I'll try that. 



zgrav said:


> Was the sound the same regardless of whether it was in the enclosure or outside of the enclosure?



Yes. Changes nothing. 



Nostradoomus said:


> Also maybe try hooking up a battery to it, could be your power supply



That was one of the first things I tried. 



Boba7 said:


> It seems normal to me, a lot of circuits with gain and volume maxed will squeal, especially if they’re stacked and they’re not properly buffered.
> 
> The real question is: will you ever use both channel with full gain and volume at the same time? If not, no problem!



You could be right. I wasn't quite sure if I might have made a mistake.  I checked the circuit several times. 
So I'm interested in whether other Paragons do the same.

When I use the pedal with "normal" settings, there's no Problem at all. 


Thank you all! 

Greetings 
Michael


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## Travis (Aug 21, 2020)

I have whistling noises in past with paragon just becouse the TC1044SCPA was from tayda...


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## Loetlurch (Aug 21, 2020)

RCZ said:


> I have whistling noises in past with paragon just becouse the TC1044SCPA was from tayda...



Did you replace the IC with another one?


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## Travis (Aug 22, 2020)

Yes and I solved the problem, I think the TC1044SCPA  from tayda isn´t good, try another from other site or some MAX1044, 7660SCPA.

Same issue with Kliche Mini or EQD The Warden, the IC make a lot of whistling  when I turn up the volume or the tone....


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## Nostradoomus (Aug 22, 2020)

Usually a bad charge pump is just a constant 10khz tone unaffected by the controls. By all means try swapping it out, but I’m not sure it’s the case here. Always read the data sheets to make sure what you are buying is the right one, usually designated by the S following the model number 1044S, 7660S etc. I haven’t bought any from Tayda in a long time as they seemed to be fakes most times. DigiKey or Mouser/Smallbear are a good bet.


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## Loetlurch (Aug 23, 2020)

Thanks @Nostradoomus and @RCZ


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## Dameetch (Sep 19, 2021)

Loetlurch said:


> Thanks @Nostradoomus and @RCZ


I realize this thread is a bit old, but which IC did you end up using that worked?


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