# Fighting the urge to give up



## metalguy55 (Feb 4, 2022)

How do you curb the desire to give up? I'm about 3 years and 12 pedals into building pedals and literally not one pedal I've made has worked. Going so slow, methodical, testing and cleaning every component before and after soldering and none of it seems to work. I make a pedal and it just doesn't work so I try again and again and again.. and at this point I'm just sick of it. A couple months ago In a last ditch effort I bought the aft preamp, titana2, pariah mid-boost, and clandestine preamp just to put together the easiest ones I could find and had 0 luck. Looking at all the equipment, parts, time, money, and research put in to this hobby and its depressing to think that I could have been playing guitar this whole time. I buy the pedals I want too so now I'm wondering why I even started this hobby.


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## Big Monk (Feb 4, 2022)

metalguy55 said:


> How do you curb the desire to give up? I'm about 3 years and 12 pedals into building pedals and literally not one pedal I've made has worked. Going so slow, methodical, testing and cleaning every component before and after soldering and none of it seems to work. I make a pedal and it just doesn't work so I try again and again and again.. and at this point I'm just sick of it. A couple months ago In a last ditch effort I bought the aft preamp, titana2, pariah mid-boost, and clandestine preamp just to put together the easiest ones I could find and had 0 luck. Looking at all the equipment, parts, time, money, and research put in to this hobby and its depressing to think that I could have been playing guitar this whole time. I buy the pedals I want too so now I'm wondering why I even started this hobby.



I think we’ve all been there when starting out. 

Do you troubleshoot the pedals that don’t work?


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## jeffwhitfield (Feb 5, 2022)

One thing that might help is to post up pics of the PCB's you're working on. We can help by looking at the PCB and determining maybe where you're making some mistakes. Also, listing the equipment you're using will help too. The wrong soldering iron, solder, flux, and the like can make any build an absolute nightmare.


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## dawson (Feb 5, 2022)

That's rough, I'd be frustrated too.
I wonder though- if none of your pedals are working, it's possible that some or all of them share an error.  If that's the case, possibly with the help of a troubleshooting thread, you may be able to solve and fix all 12 of your builds at once and you'll be scrambling for patch cables.
Won't that be a good day?

*Also, there's no shame in quitting- this hobby isn't for everyone, however, by your description and the amount of effort you've put into it already, I think it'd be worth one final push to post a troubleshooting thread with plenty of pictures.  It really may be something simple and fixable you did wrong 12 times.


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## Stickman393 (Feb 5, 2022)

Well, the good news here is that failure is kind of a packaged deal with life.

If the guitar pedals you build don't work, I guarantee you that there is an identifiable reason WHY they don't work.

And that reason has nothing to do with who you, personally, are.  Nobody's uniquely blessed with a supernatural ability to fuck up every build for forever.  Nobody is invariably doomed to be shit at building pedals for forever.  And, truth told, nobody gets to success by themselves.

My dad taught me to solder.  I have countless individuals online that I owe my gratitude to for sharing their knowledge for free.  I work in a field that taught me LOTS about electrical theory that I wouldn't know otherwise.

90% of errors, when it comes to putting a pedal together, comes from incorrect wiring, shorts from solder bridges or wire whiskers, and reverse polarity on polarized components.

If you're consistently building pedals that don't work, you're likely repeating a specific mistake.  Maybe you've got your center on 9vdc wired to positive.  Maybe you have your inputs and outputs reversed.  Maybe you're wiring your 1/4" tip connection to ground.

Maybe you're using a switched power jack, but you're connecting your positive lead to the wrong, switched terminal.

That's what the troubleshooting forum is for.  Just take good pictures, follow troubleshooting forum etiquette, and if you don't have one yet...buy a multi-meter.  Build an audio probe.  Learn to read schematics.

You don't have to know everything instantly.  Hell, that would rob you of all those "ah hah!" Moments that can rejuvenate you and lead to an immense sense of satisfaction.

But...this requires patience and an ability for self reflection.  To troubleshoot, you must first accept that you probably made a mistake, and that mistake exists independently of you.  Your ability to debug it or not relies entirely on your current skill level, which will change over time, and does not reflect your potential.

TL;DR, chin up brotha.  Have fun. If you're not breaking anything, you're not doing anything.


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## TGP39 (Feb 5, 2022)

My first 4 pedals I built didn’t work.  I was meticulous just like you described.  I would build the circuit and test it before I boxed it. I posted a troubleshooting thread on another board.  It turns out that since I had the circuit face down, I was plugging my guitar into the output jack and the amp to the input jack.  All 4 builds were done right, but tested wrong. 
Lesson for me is you have a large number of really awesome pedal builders who have “been there / done that” on this board.  Open up a troubleshooting thread describing your problem and I bet you things will turn around.  
Best of luck,
Steve / PharmerFx


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## Grubb (Feb 5, 2022)

Getting one to fire up will turn the tide. Please post your builds in the troubleshooting section, guaranteed someone will spot the problem and you'll get to muck around with a pedal you built yourself. It's a great feeling!


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## BuddytheReow (Feb 5, 2022)

troubleshooting is part of the learning process and can be frustrating and drive your patience. Once you’ve figured out your mistake (I’m sensing a common theme) you won’t make it again






						TUTORIAL - Troubleshooting 101
					

There comes a time for every builder to spend multiple hours soldering, wiring, and breadboarding a certain circuit just to have it work incorrectly, if at all. This could happen on your first build or any build after that. This write up is to help you in your quest to figure out why it isn't...




					forum.pedalpcb.com


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## andare (Feb 5, 2022)

Kudos to your for sticking to something for so long in the face of failure.

Lots of people here can help. Post good pictures of your pedal guts and be ready to follow the advice you will receive.


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## Dan M (Feb 5, 2022)

I haven’t built any of the pedals for you listed, but the Titania looks like the simplest.

Maybe start a troubleshooting thread for that one and get it running.  It doesn’t have jfets to bias, or ICs, or germanium transistors.

I’ve only built 20 pedals, so I’m still fairly new.  
When my pedals don’t work, I’ve found there’s only 10 possible reasons, in this order:
#1-7:  bad soldering
#8:  part installed wrong (wrong value, installed backwards, etc)
#9:  a short due to a stray or loose wire OR bad soldering 
#10:  a broken part.  Possibly due to melting it because of bad soldering


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## jimilee (Feb 5, 2022)

After 10 years of building, my fire right up ratio is probably one to three. I still have to troubleshoot. These fine folks are super delicious in getting things going.


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## PBWilson1970 (Feb 5, 2022)

It can be maddening for sure! I remember making a small batch of pedals and a handful of them just didn't work right. Facing the daunting task of retracing my steps and checking all those connections was a challenge. 

Here's a few silly things I've done to screw up pedal projects:

Wiring input and output jacks backwards
Not installing ICs or transistors in their sockets
Orienting the 3PDT switch wrong
Not using heat sinks on more delicate parts when I was just learning to solder
Not checking pinouts of transistors
Not checking resistor for correct value
Solder bridges!
Not cutting a trace fully when using stripboard

I'm sure there will be more!


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## jimilee (Feb 5, 2022)

PBWilson1970 said:


> It can be maddening for sure! I remember making a small batch of pedals and a handful of them just didn't work right. Facing the daunting task of retracing my steps and checking all those connections was a challenge.
> 
> Here's a few silly things I've done to screw up pedal projects:
> 
> ...


I still do some of these now, I bet all of us do!


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## fig (Feb 5, 2022)

You haven't recently broken up with a voodoo priestess have you?

Just look at this unrivaled support base available to you. I'm proud to be the village idiot of this bunch!

Challenge: Choose one non-functional build and post it on troubleshooting. 

If you accept and follow through, not only will you find the problem, you'll be in a better position to better decide if this is for you or not. 

All the best!


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## peccary (Feb 5, 2022)

Yeah, dude. Get that Aft or another small parts count build up in troubleshooting. Have you seen some of the Frankenstein's monsters walking out of that place? Lifted pads, jumpers, all kinds of stuff. The folks here can help if you're determined enough. Post some good photos. Most of the time it's something rather simple.


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## Paradox916 (Feb 5, 2022)

fig said:


> I'm proud to be the village idiot of this bunch!


Damn And I was really hoping to fill that slot, so that must mean  Im the kid that has to wear a bicycle helmet all the time…..


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## Harry Klippton (Feb 5, 2022)

Do you enjoy the activities that go into building a pedal? Not just populating a board or soldering, but also reading build docs, planning out a build, and troubleshooting? 

Early on, I viewed pedal building as only populating a board and soldering. I didn't like wiring everything and always rushed it, but then I learned to love it and focus on doing a good job. I made a habit of not even testing pedals the same day I worked on em, so that when they didn't work, THAT was the activity I did that day- focus on figuring it out. 

Ultimately, it's ok if pedal building is not for you. I've explored and given up lots of different hobbies over the years cuz I liked the idea or end result but not the process, or the activities of the hobby didn't fit into my lifestyle


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## pcb rookie (Feb 5, 2022)

I hear you! I started about 2 years ago. I struggled a few times but  in the end I was able to fix most of them.

There is one of my built that I just could not figure it out. I keep placing it aside and I at some point decided to reorder the PCB and components to start fresh. Just before I was going for a fresh start (with all components on hands), I decided to post a thread in the trouble shooting section of this forum.

I took time to clean the PCB, inspect all solders and components (value, position and orientation), post pictures and voltage measures of the values.






						Super '64 OD troubleshooting
					

Fishing building the Super '64 OD. LED is working fine. I'm getting sound on by pass mode and clean low volume sound when engaged. All pots are turned fully clock wise including the trimpots. I looked at all solders for cold solders, bridge etc. Then cleaned the PCB. I refloweds all sorders...




					forum.pedalpcb.com
				




There are a lot of good and knowledgeable people willing to help and share their knowledge.

I can tell you that I learned way more in this process that I did in all the previous builds that worked on 1st try. Not only did I learn a lot that but it  help me process troubleshooting further on my own on following builds. I actually enjoyed the process with the support of members on this forum.

* I built a audio probe in the process and learned to use it which as become my most useful troubleshooting tool.

At the end of the day, it actually worked and I've been enjoying this pedal ... maybe more than the overs I own!


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## Paradox916 (Feb 5, 2022)

It’s definitely not an easy hobby.  My two cents for you is pay close attention to component orientation, that has nailed me more than a few times, pick one pedal you really want to get operational.. and stick it out to the bitter or sweetened,  post or bump an existing troubleshooting thread, seen it through man, when a heavy hitter that obviously knows what they are doing gives you advice or direction… just do it even if you think or know that’s not the problem, they have to deal in “known” conditions and not assumptions( I think this is the most prevalent reason peoples troubleshooting threads die and go nowhere.) if you report back the findings promptly you will get through it quicker there are a lot of people that are in here daily. And lastly enjoy the process,if it was easy, it wouldn’t be any fun.


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## peccary (Feb 5, 2022)

I am kind of dumb and don't test my builds before boxing them up, but because of that I spend time going over the completed boards with a magnifying glass before installing it in an enclosure. 

Every mistake that's prevented a board I made from working was because I wasn't paying attention to something. A reversed diode or cap, a solder bridge, whatever. A good visual inspection (I usually do a couple, giving some time in between) along side the build docs has saved me a lot of time.


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## fig (Feb 5, 2022)

Paradox916 said:


> Damn And I was really hoping to fill that slot, so that must mean  Im the kid that has to wear a bicycle helmet all the time…..


<-------It's official


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## JamieJ (Feb 5, 2022)

That is amazing!! 🤣🤣🤣


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## Robert (Feb 5, 2022)

fig said:


> <-------It's official



You've earned it, and don't ever let anyone tell you different.


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## fig (Feb 5, 2022)

...and _that_ makes it special!


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## grabo99 (Feb 5, 2022)

I messed up 3 Teddy Fuzz pcb's before building a working one. What helped me is getting into the habit of checking continutiy of just soldered parts. Takes time and is annoying but saves so much time in trouble shooting.


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## jeffwhitfield (Feb 5, 2022)

fig said:


> <-------It's official


Well...you must be useful. Otherwise you'd have been run out of town already.


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## fig (Feb 5, 2022)

jeffwhitfield said:


> Well...you must be useful. Otherwise you'd have been run out of town already.


It's likely been discussed at length.


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## jimilee (Feb 5, 2022)

I caught a pot on fire once while building a Octavia. It was pretty exiting at first. Those things smell terrible.


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## fig (Feb 5, 2022)

jimilee said:


> I caught a pot on fire once while building a Octavia. It was pretty exiting at first. Those things smell terrible.


bitchin'


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## jimilee (Feb 5, 2022)

fig said:


> bitchin'


Indeed


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## grabo99 (Feb 5, 2022)

jimilee said:


> I caught a pot on fire once while building a Octavia. It was pretty exiting at first. Those things smell terrible.


I've been catching pot on fire for years. Oh that kind, my bad


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## Matopotato (Feb 6, 2022)

My first two "Builds" were watching my friend do them (and passing him the correct components etc.) That was a very helpful start.
Then I built a Rift Octave Fuzz, with very clear instructions , and it worked first time. Even modded a trimpot to a pot on the outside.
So I was expecting the next, a Fuzzrite, to be a breeze. But most things went wrong. When I finally got sound out of it, I had the pots wrong way, so volume and fuzz kind of worked backwards. Annoying. So I decided to desolder those pots.
I ended up destroying the whole thing. Apparently soldering technique and desoldering ditto are quite different... I ended up thinking I would get back to troubleshoot later on, but instead got a new Fuzzrite kit and built one that worked. And the first board went to the spare parts section.
Since then I've been drawn to more and more complex builds and I learn a lot that I have great use of for more normal builds.
So my tips (might have been mentioned elsewhere) besides the 101 and all other who write in this thread is to build a very simple audio probe.
Very googlable: Use a phono jack, alligator clip and a cap. It was very revealing to trace the audio on the board. If you have or can get looper to have your hands free from strumming, even better.
Using a DMM in "beep" mode is also my best help so far.

I have also dabbled a little bit with "from schematics to strip/vero board builds" and find that breadboarding might be a bit tedious, but it will show if all components "work" and "work together". Once that sings, you know you are on your way.

The guitar and amp cables to out and in, is a common miss for me too. I now always use blue wire for in and green for out. (YMMV)
Pulling existing pedalboard in and out and swapping cables when testing also cause a lot of confusion. One favorite is to have a noise gate pedal in the chain in front, but it interacts in the FX loop (4 cable method). And it is an auto-turn-on pedal as well. So I had some annoying volume drops until I found and turned off the FX loop or that pedal. And sadly, not just once...

Really keen to follow your progress, there is a lot of help, support and dare I say it 🤗 in this forum, so keep reaching out.


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## Harry Klippton (Feb 6, 2022)

Maybe he already gave up 🤷


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## NickC (Feb 6, 2022)

as has already been said, maybe his pedals have the same mistake in common, a few photos would be enough to reveal the truth!


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## mybud (Feb 6, 2022)

Don’t give up. It can be very frustrating when builds don’t work as you’d like them to. 

In my own case, I spent about six months with constructions that worked fine in testing but failed when I boxed them up. Took me a fair length of time to figure out that I had been using switched jacks, wired wrong so that inserting the jack switched the input off. Whoa!

Then I spent awhile trying to build traditional Fuzz Faces, none of which worked either since they were positive ground wired to a metal DC jack and required biasing for the Ge transistors, which I didn’t understand. Took time and patience to figure out my mistakes, not to mention getting a better DMM and an audio probe and doing a bit of theory to figure out what the most likely mistakes might be. The point I’m trying to make is that there’s a learning curve to this, but the reward of something finally working (or working the first time straight up) is ermm… rewarding.

I still make mistakes. I have a lot to learn, but forums like this seem to be great places to learn more and get support from more knowledgeable and helpful folks, who might also have struggled initially.

Again, don’t give up. You might have a consistent wiring issue or something that another pair of eyes will spot.


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## Barry (Feb 6, 2022)

NickC said:


> as has already been said, maybe his pedals have the same mistake in common, a few photos would be enough to reveal the truth!


He has a couple of troubleshooting threads active


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## Barry (Feb 6, 2022)

The advice I give anyone starting out, is to master soldering, buy some strip or veroboard a few components and solder until you think you got it and then solder some more! Build a simple circuit like a 4k7 resistor with a LED and battery clip and light up that LED, then you'll be almost ready! I've seen troubleshooting reports that say they've checked and reflowed the board and the soldering is a trainwreck!


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## NickC (Feb 6, 2022)

Barry said:


> He has a couple of troubleshooting threads active


i just saw some pictures, it seems to have a soldering problem


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## Dan M (Feb 6, 2022)

Barry said:


> The advice I give anyone starting out, is to master soldering, buy some strip or veroboard a few components


That’s what I did.  For less than 5 dollars you can buy a good size board and a pile of leds and resistors.  By the time you fill up the board, you’ll go from complete beginner to making confident connections.

We’ve all made a cold joint, then outright lied to our own face “I’m sure it’s fine”.  Knowing all along that it wasn’t fine.


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## mybud (Feb 6, 2022)

Dan M said:


> We’ve all made a cold joint, then outright lied to our own face “I’m sure it’s fine”. Knowing all along that it wasn’t fine.



Prezackly, Dan.


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## fig (Feb 6, 2022)

Harry Klippton said:


> Maybe he already gave up 🤷


Irrelevant. We must continue to offer encouragement!


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## princeofyams (Feb 6, 2022)

I remember when I started, I was so excited and rushed through 2 easy pedals and soldered the IC's upside down with no sockets.  It took me weeks (no motivation) to desolder them and get them back together only to hear them making terrible noises because I had wired the input/output backwards.

It takes a few mistakes to learn how to do things right, but by golly is it worth learning. I tried to save a few seconds soldering - and cost myself hours in desoldering and troubleshooting. 

Who knows, maybe all your broken pedals just have some crossed wires like some of mine did? I hope you keep trying anyway, I know for a fact when you get your first pedal working it's going to be a happy day for you! Just take your time and never be afraid to ask for help.


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## Paradox916 (Feb 6, 2022)

Harry Klippton said:


> Maybe he already gave up 🤷


I say we give him a week before we call him MIA… it’s the weekend sometimes you just got to walk away from the bench for a minute…🤣


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## Harry Klippton (Feb 6, 2022)

Paradox916 said:


> I say we give him a week before we call him MIA… it’s the weekend sometimes you just got to walk away from the bench for a minute…🤣


Nonsense. This place should be called the overlook hotel


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## Matopotato (Feb 6, 2022)

Harry Klippton said:


> Maybe he already gave up 🤷
> View attachment 22618


Maybe... but we're hanging in there... or here... Hopefully metalguy55 checks in again and will at least feel the support.


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## jeffwhitfield (Feb 6, 2022)

I do hope he checks in on this message. When I started out, many of the pedals I built, while they worked, didn't work properly. 

In fact, one of them, a Boss FZ-2 clone, had a mode that definitely didn't sound right. I didn't know that till much later when I heard a demo and realized that one of the modes didn't sound like mine. I tried diagnosing the issue but never found it. Decided to build a simpler version of the same pedal and threw the other one in my graveyard box.

Out of a good 80 pedals or so that I've built, a good dozen ended up either in the graveyard or thrown aside for debugging later on. Wasn't always successful in debugging...but that's just part the gig. You're gonna fuck up...no question about it. You might do so way early on but it's a learning experience. Dig in and learn from your mistakes...that's how you get the most out of it. It's like that with any skill.


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## Stickman393 (Feb 6, 2022)

GAHHHHH!!!!! ENCOURAGING WORDS!!!!!

SO MUCH HOPE!!!!!!

LIFE IS FUCKING BEAUTIFUL!!!!!

NEVER GIVE UP!   DON'T YOU FUCKING DARE!!!

YOU ARE A BEAUTIFUL AND  UNIQUE FLOWER AND STARFISH COMBINED THAT FLIES ON RAINBOWS!!!!!!


GAHHHHHHHHBBB!!!!!!!!!IEGEJLFBEIENAOEBEVNBWUSNAGG


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## fig (Feb 6, 2022)

Stickman393 said:


> GAHHHHH!!!!! ENCOURAGING WORDS!!!!!
> 
> SO MUCH HOPE!!!!!!
> 
> ...


deeep breaths.....in....out.....in.....out.........

there now.........feelin' better?.....gooooood....


Mark it Donnie!


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## cdwillis (Feb 6, 2022)

The first three or so pedals I attempted to build (LPB-1, Devi Ever Soda Meiser, and Z Vex Super Hard On) on vero board would not work. I was really really frustrated because I had picked some of the lowest parts count circuits to get my feet wet and taken my time slowly building each one only to have it not work. I was getting sound through in bypass mode and my LED would light up when I turned it on, but there was no signal at all when I turned it on. It turns out that I had my 3pdt switch turned sideways because I just assumed that's how it was supposed to be oriented and the diagram I was following didn't make it obvious that the pins needed to be horizontal. 

Even once you're more experienced you have little errors sometimes that you have to figure out and it is pretty frustrating. I don't know anyone that actively enjoys troubleshooting, maybe some masochists do  I've had to learn to deal with offboard wiring, which is my least favorite part of building pedals. I wouldn't say I enjoy it, but I dread it a lot less now that I've done it more.

If you've built that many and none of them have worked you're probably making the same error repeatedly. Everybody here is really helpful and will look over your builds to see if we can help. It may be that one issue that once you figure out it you can go back and fix all those pedals pretty easily.


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## JamieJ (Feb 6, 2022)




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## Matopotato (Feb 6, 2022)

cdwillis said:


> ..... I don't know anyone that actively enjoys troubleshooting, maybe some masochists do  I've had to learn to deal with offboard wiring, which is my least favorite part of building pedals. I wouldn't say I enjoy it, but I dread it a lot less now that I've done it more.....


If and once you manage to find the fault and fix it, there is often a moment of elation, euphoria, ...  . So I don't like troubleshooting either, but I like to tie it together with a "joyful" ending to make it feel better. And as you pick up new tricks, your confidence ought to grow a little each time. Just completed a Meatball clone from another maker. It was complex. I had one bad solder found with audio probe (first use) and another, unclear where because I redid the wires to the stomp board after some suspected glitching and it worked. But the pedal is quite complex to dial in. Add a sensitivity to playing, pickups in the mix and it was quite easy to get lost. But I learned how to trace connections better with my DMM, and how to use a looper + audio probe. I still expect it to have some more surprises in for me considering how much it has been like teaching a cat tricks, or handling a 5-year old with a temper...


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## grabo99 (Feb 6, 2022)

What helped me in learning soldering was buying a "diy digital clock kit" off Amazon. Most of the components are bigger and easier to place and solder. Completing that put me in a position where I knew how to solder and had no problems with pcbs. 

It makes me kinda sad that OP might've given up. I've found so much joy and zen in learning about electronics and building stuff, hope they find their way back to it.


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## jimilee (Feb 6, 2022)

You deserve to build, no no, you deserve to build….you’re not listening, you deserve to build.


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## jeffwhitfield (Feb 7, 2022)




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## Mentaltossflycoon (Feb 7, 2022)




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## nickquack (Feb 7, 2022)

I found that starting with a BYOC kit helped alot; looking at how thorough and clear Aion FX documentation is, I would recommend starting there too. I had no soldering experience 6 months ago, so even though kits don't really let you experiment too much, it gave me a much needed confidence boost when I managed to put it together. You'll generally have a much greater chance of success with a kit, rather than sourcing the parts and figuring out the offboard wiring yourself. 

So even though I had some issues with later builds (completely wrecked a Chalumeau board), I had the motivation to push through because I _knew_ I was capable of putting together a working pedal. 

I will say though, 3 years is a long time. It sounds like there might be something fundamentally wrong with your build process. What sort of issues have you been facing in your builds?


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## Grubb (Feb 11, 2022)

PBWilson1970 said:


> Not installing ICs or transistors in their sockets


Did this on a couple of recent builds. Thankfully a quick and painless fix.


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## Grubb (Feb 19, 2022)

Grubb said:


> Did this on a couple of recent builds. Thankfully a quick and painless fix.


I've just done it a third time 🤦😅


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## Gordo (Feb 19, 2022)

I'm calling TOQ (time of quitting).  8:31am...<covers user with white sheet>.


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## jimilee (Feb 19, 2022)

I guess this guy gave up?


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## Matopotato (Feb 19, 2022)

jimilee said:


> I guess this guy gave up?


Which makes me wonder why launching this thread and not come back to it?


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## peccary (Feb 19, 2022)

F


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## Feral Feline (Feb 20, 2022)

OP is too busy building pedals, after figuring out the repeatable-error, to come back with a come back.


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