# LM308N - Any Non-Rat Pedals Use It?



## PangeaDestructor (Jun 22, 2022)

I ordered a few 308s from Banzai because I needed one for a VFE Alpha Dog, figured I may as well grab multiples. I'm aware the OP07 gives the same sound, I did it for the mojo.

I'm looking around and curious if any pedals other than the Rat are known for using this specific chip? I'm not seeing anything other than possibly a JHS Angry Charlie v2, though the pcb here uses 072 and 833. I guess I could drop it in place of the 833, right? Any other options?


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## K Pedals (Jun 22, 2022)

Pandora’s Box uses 2…


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## ICTRock (Jun 22, 2022)

K Pedals said:


> Pandora’s Box uses 2…


still a rat


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## jimilee (Jun 22, 2022)

Anything that uses a single opamp is my guess.


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## Diynot (Jun 22, 2022)

The GGG MXR headphone amp uses a TL071 that you could sub with the LM308 not sure how it would sound though.


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## Robert (Jun 22, 2022)

https://www.pedalpcb.com/product/cattledriver/ 
 (although still Rat-like)


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## spi (Jun 22, 2022)

PangeaDestructor said:


> I guess I could drop it in place of the 833, right?


LM833 is a dual op-amp.  LM308 won't be a drop in replacement.


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## benny_profane (Jun 22, 2022)

Your best best is a Rat-inspired circuit (or finding another design from before the late 80s or so). That chip has been OOP for quite some time, so I doubt any new design  would spec it.


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## spi (Jun 22, 2022)

benny_profane said:


> Your best best is a Rat-inspired circuit (or finding another design from before the late 80s or so). That chip has been OOP for quite some time, so I doubt any new design  would spec it.



I'm surprised that there aren't new circuits designed around the OP07 though.  Still available, and just as "good" as LM308 (or maybe 308s were't so good after all).


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## benny_profane (Jun 22, 2022)

spi said:


> I'm surprised that there aren't new circuits designed around the OP07 though.  Still available, and just as "good" as LM308 (or maybe 308s were't so good after all).


The Rat is my favorite distortion. But the LM308 truly is an absolute garbage op amp for any other purpose. But tubes sorta fall into a similar category—they are used for their particular characteristics which happen to make them unsuitable in other circumstance. 

There are plenty of new circuits—they’re all just put in the category of Rat-inspired. If you add tons of elements to it, the raggedness and unique response of the chip can be lost. See also 741 circuits and other 250/Dist+ pedals.


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## jimilee (Jun 22, 2022)

spi said:


> I'm surprised that there aren't new circuits designed around the OP07 though.  Still available, and just as "good" as LM308 (or maybe 308s were't so good after all).


If I’m remembering right, the opamp big muff uses a single opamp, or at least I’ve seen a few that did. The PCBs I have, do.


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## HamishR (Jun 22, 2022)

The Honey Bee is a Rat derivative but uses the CA3130. I wonder what a HB would sound like with an LM308? FWIW whenever I have built a Rat or Expandora-style pedal I use a CA3130.


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## mdc (Jun 22, 2022)

HamishR said:


> The Honey Bee is a Rat derivative but uses the CA3130. I wonder what a HB would sound like with an LM308? FWIW whenever I have built a Rat or Expandora-style pedal I use a CA3130.


Probably no different than swapping in a different CA3130 would sound.


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## HamishR (Jun 22, 2022)

Ha!  I think you're probably right!


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## jeffwhitfield (Jun 23, 2022)

Actually, I think the way the LM308 works is that....well, basically, if you put it in any pedal that uses a standard op-amp it instantly turns it into a Rat.

Got a TS-808 with a RC4558? Switch it out with a LM308 and you got an instant Rat!

Lovepedal Zendrive with a NE5532? Why? A LM308 is way better! Pop it in...instant RAT!!!

Even works with many fuzz pedals! Op-amp Big Muff? Oh, wait...that's a RC4558 as well. But it also has a UA741CP! Replace both of them wiht a LM308 and you get (you guess it!) A DOUBLE RAT! Wheeee!!

The possibilities are endless...as long as you realize that every pedal becomes a Rat.


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## Feral Feline (Jun 23, 2022)

Facetious a little Jeff?

The 4558 & 5532 are both dual op-amp chips...

So while you could replace the IC-Muff's 741 with a 308, the 4558 will require *two* (2) more 308s ... a triple-308 pedal!

Mwahhahahahahahahhhhaaaaaaa...


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## Matmosphere (Jun 23, 2022)

I went down this rabbit whole a while back over on another forum. Most everything that uses that chip is a rat clone, a modded rat clone or heavily inspired by the rat. The only one that turned up for me was an Attack-Decay pedal from the seventies. I haven't had a chance but I want to build it one of these days.









						Paia 5730 Gator
					

Collection of vero (stripboard) & tagboard layouts for 100s of popular guitar effects, with over 500 verified designs. DIY your own boutique effects!




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## mdc (Jun 23, 2022)

Looks like that uses a LM3080, not an LM308.


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## Feral Feline (Jun 23, 2022)

Yup, would love to build the Gator, stick that one in the wish list!
Would be cool to build a dual one with a single 13700 IC (I hate waste!).


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## jeffwhitfield (Jun 23, 2022)

Feral Feline said:


> Facetious a little Jeff?
> 
> The 4558 & 5532 are both dual op-amp chips...
> 
> ...


Oh, I'm just teasing. 

Honestly, I can't think of anything to use an LM308 for. OP07's are just as good and they're pretty much being relegated to Rat-like circuits. Everything else that uses op-amps pretty much uses standard stuff (4558, TL072, etc.). Then there's those oddballs like the Zendrive (NE5532P) and such.


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## Chuck D. Bones (Jun 24, 2022)

I recently breadboarded a Roger Mayer Voodoo 1*.  It uses an LM308 and unlike the Rat, it won't work right if you sub in another random single opamp.  The LM308 is low power and in the Voodoo 1, that's important because of how RM arranged the power filtering.  No, the Voodoo 1 is not a Rat.  Save the LM308s for circuits that need them and build up a stock of good single opamps: LF351, TL071, OP07, CA3130, etc. for everything else.  

* I'll post something about that breadboard in the usual place this weekend.


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## jesuscrisp (Jun 24, 2022)

DOD250/Distortion Plus do also sound good using an LM308. I bet you could also use it in place of the LM741 in an op amp muff, just maybe try to include the compensation cap.

And I disagree with the OP07 being just as good but that's another topic.


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