# Recommendations for a first time build project



## Robert (Jul 3, 2021)

We have a lot of first time builders here, and from time to time they tackle projects that are a bit too steep for a first time builder...   With that in mind, I'm considering putting together a kit that includes everything needed for an absolute first time build (aside from tools).  

I'm looking for recommendations for a circuit that would be good for this.   It doesn't necessarily have to be a project that is already available here.

What I have in mind is:

High chance of success
Low parts count
No rare or hard to find components
No biasing / adjustments required
Preferably a two or three knobber
Something that appeals to a general audience


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## fig (Jul 3, 2021)

I think this is an excellent idea! One you've likely considered for awhile.

You have many that would work well. El Sol might be a consideration. [but it's a single knobber]


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## benny_profane (Jul 3, 2021)

Just to add to your original list: I’d really like to dispel the idea that old Ge fuzz circuits are good for beginners. I see fuzz faces, tonebenders, et al. suggested for beginners quite often. The low part count really belies the amount of effort that goes into sourcing parts and constructing a good circuit. That being said, Si versions that are tolerant of part specs would be great suggestions.


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## fig (Jul 3, 2021)

I'd suggest the DC jacks with the outside nut. This might curb the frustration level in the event of an issue.

Edit: I'll just tack on here;

.5x more wire than needed. Someone who has not built one has more difficulty _envisioning _ the amount of wire needed, and could easily cut themselves short.

IC and/or transistor Sockets

A Wiki or thread with detailed instructions.

I'd limit any options initially.


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## Paradox916 (Jul 3, 2021)

How about the Guvernator? it’s not a crazy number of parts. All can be sourced from Tayda.. (not sure if that 9n6 cap is a deal breaker for requirement, just put a 10nf in there). It was one of my first builds and by far the easiest one to date... great sounding pedal that’s pretty versatile.... I’m not sure if it gets much more straightforward than that... just my two cents. Hope that helps.
​


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## peccary (Jul 3, 2021)

The Mercurial is not only an amazingly useful pedal, it is also a simple 3 knobber with easy to find parts. I think that could easily be a fun and useful first build.


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## Robert (Jul 3, 2021)

benny_profane said:


> Just to add to your original list: I’d really like to dispel the idea that old Ge fuzz circuits are good for beginners.



The irony is that I've personally had more trouble with "simple" fuzz circuits than the larger more complex ones.


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## Flying (Jul 3, 2021)

My suggestions:

OD 1: https://www.pedalpcb.com/product/jetaime/

OD 2: https://www.pedalpcb.com/product/bbgun/

Modulation: https://www.pedalpcb.com/product/woodpecker/


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## JamieJ (Jul 3, 2021)

My first build was an EP booster which was pretty straight forward.


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## AgAuthority (Jul 3, 2021)

Everybody needs a RAT in there life

Ag


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## benny_profane (Jul 3, 2021)

Robert said:


> The irony is that I've personally had more trouble with "simple" fuzz circuits than the larger more complex ones.


Absolutely. I feel like I have built enough variety to have an informed opinion. ‘Simple’ fuzz circuits take far more planning and effort than even some of the more temperamental BBD time/mod effects in my experience. They are one of the few effects categories that require at least a foundational understanding of analog design and core principles.


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## jubal81 (Jul 3, 2021)

Red Llama might fit the bill. Mythos makes a copy, too, I believe.


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## benny_profane (Jul 3, 2021)

I think a three knob circuit may be best. I initially was thinking that a two-control circuit would be preferable (see below)—but the added stability of the third control might make things easier.

As much as I love the Rat, I don’t think that’s a good project for beginners. The IC issue becomes a rabbit hole of dubious info/opinions and may have people trying to source the 308 from sketchy places and possibly get burned.

I think a 250 (and distortion+) with a mods section would be great. A stock BOM for the 250 eliminates Ge parts. Perhaps a passive filter option for experimentation would be good (and adds a third pot for stability).

Ultimately, the documentation would have to be expanded. Including general instructions and perhaps a brief description of component roles would go a long way. 

I started with the GCI brutalist and that documentation was extremely helpful for me as a first timer.


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## caiofilipini (Jul 3, 2021)

Mach 1 is a great option, IMO. Fairly easy build, sounds great.


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## Robert (Jul 3, 2021)

benny_profane said:


> I think a three knob circuit may be best. I initially was thinking that a two-control circuit would be preferable (see below)—but the added stability of the third control might make things easier.



This was my reasoning behind two or three knobs over one.   

There would definitely need to be more detailed documentation than usual, this would be the one time I would cover the whole "This is how you snap the tab off a potentiometer" sort of topics.

I would _possibly_ want to commission someone to do a step-by-step video build as well.


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## Barry (Jul 3, 2021)

Robert said:


> This was my reasoning behind two or three knobs over one.
> 
> There would definitely need to be more detailed documentation than usual, this would be the one time I would cover the whole "This is how you snap the tab off a potentiometer" sort of topics.
> 
> I would _possibly_ want to commission someone to do a step-by-step video build as well.


@jjjimi84 is all set up for video demo's


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## spi (Jul 3, 2021)

A Tubescreamer or any of the son-of-screamer variants would be good too.  Although tube screamers don't seem as popular as they used to be.

Maybe a Timmy would be more popular--dealing with a toggle switch might be harder for an absolute noob.  You could make a simplified 3-knob, no-switch Timmy variant (I guess that'd be a Mach 1)?

Mach 1/Dod 250/MXR Dist+/Red LLama as suggested above are all good options.  (Which made me realize there's not a Red Llama PPCB yet--I'd build one of those).

Also, a boost or electra distortion is easy.  I really like my speaker cranker--one knob simplicity.


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## JamieJ (Jul 3, 2021)

Could be cool to have one kit set up for boost, overdrive and distortion. All drives bases covered so first time builders can choose what takes their fancy.


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## AgAuthority (Jul 3, 2021)

I would ask is this something you really want to do?  To me it implies a responsibility on your part to help all these folks make their pedal work. Peeple these days......  expectations can be hard to meet

Ag


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## zgrav (Jul 3, 2021)

I think the other thing to consider is picking a circuit that a beginner would have a high interest in building that also meets the other concerns that are listed.  So ideally something folks are already motivated to try to build to save money instead of buying.  Maybe the "coming soon" Dragons Breath pedal would be a good choice.


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## benny_profane (Jul 3, 2021)

AgAuthority said:


> I would ask is this something you really want to do?  To me it implies a responsibility on your part to help all these folks make their pedal work. Peeple these days......  expectations can be hard to meet
> 
> Ag


Have you _seen _the forum (sometimes)?


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## AgAuthority (Jul 3, 2021)

benny_profane said:


> Have you _seen _the forum (sometimes)?


Had a certain thread in mind while posting this.....


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## benny_profane (Jul 3, 2021)

AgAuthority said:


> Had a certain thread in mind while posting this.....


Yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.


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## peccary (Jul 3, 2021)

I think that putting something in the documentation similar to Madbean could help cover that: I'm super busy and can't do individual issues, but go visit the hive-mind of the troubleshooting forum and you'll get some good help. Something like that.


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## Bricksnbeatles (Jul 3, 2021)

Honestly I feel like one of the best three-knob circuits for a beginner is a fixed-bias silicon fuzz face with a muff tone stack.


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## benny_profane (Jul 3, 2021)

Bricksnbeatles said:


> Honestly I feel like one of the best three-knob circuits for a beginner is a fixed-bias silicon fuzz face with a muff tone stack.


The _only_ issue I have there is that the gain ratio between Q1 and Q2 is not insignificant. That could be addressed by stipulating different part numbers for each, but since the hFE range can be quite large it's not a guarantee.


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## SillyOctpuss (Jul 3, 2021)

Jan Ray.  I know it has four knobs and I know it's a Timmy but

A - As much as I wanted to hate it it sounds great.
B - It's not a hard build
C - There is a desirability amongst pedal noobs for something super expensive and flash
D - Fuck Vemuram for pretending they spent years in R&D and didn't just give us a Timmy with controls which are the right way round and a reduced EQ range.  Oh and a trim pot which is only there to make it look like it's something other than a Timmy.
E - Uh did I say fuck Vemuram? I don't remember


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## benny_profane (Jul 3, 2021)

Why do most people get into building pedals in the first place? I think that should be the starting point. Fuzzes are big for people that are in it, but is that why most people begin in the first place?

I also think that this should be a PPCB original / essentially public domain circuit rather than a newer circuit.


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## manfesto (Jul 3, 2021)

The Ionizer would be a good candidate; low parts count, nothing hard to source, and a unique and useable fuzz likely outside of what most new-to-the-world-of-pedals types are used to seeing.


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## finebyfine (Jul 3, 2021)

I tried to put myself in the mindset of when I first started wanting to build pedals, and I think one of these would have a good draw:
- a muff (a specific version)
- rat
- tube screamer

I'm so wishy-washy on what to think when I hear complaints about documentation here. I don't need it myself, and selfishly want you to just keep tracing at that weirdly insane speed that you do so I can build more stuff. But on the other hand it could draw more beginners in and I think we can all testify to how many pedals we've ended up building vs how many we _thought_ we'd build when getting into it. Genuinely not sure which side I fully land on.


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## SYLV9ST9R (Jul 3, 2021)

Plecostomus Fuzz.
Easy build, low parts count, no rare stuff, sounds great.
I maybe biased (wink wink!) because it was my first build, but it was a breeze and it fired up right away (after I put the transistors in their sockets).


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## peccary (Jul 3, 2021)

finebyfine said:


> I tried to put myself in the mindset of when I first started wanting to build pedals, and I think one of these would have a good draw:
> - a muff (a specific version)
> - rat
> - tube screamer
> ...



I really like the MB, Aion, and especially Dead End build docs. I've never even bought a Dead End board but I've read the docs to at least half their builds. I really feel that I learn a lot about why certain choices were made, some history, and usually good explanations/reasoning for things being done a particular way.

I don't think that there's anything wrong with the no-nonsense build docs for PedalPCB, but that usually does assume that the person knows what's what and where to get it. Even Tayda is intimidating the first time you look for a capacitor and see 20 different ones that all appear to be exactly the same but then somehow all look totally different and then next thing you know you're wondering how in gods name you're going to fit these sausage sized caps on the board.


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## blackhatboojum (Jul 3, 2021)

As a newbie to the forum and pedal building in general...  This is a tough one to answer.  Another question was brought up, "Why do most people get into building in the first place?"  Speaking for myself,  I got into building my own pedals to save money, and to have the effects that I've always wanted for my rig.  If I’m not interested in using it, I’m not interested in building it.  A big variable in all of this, is the skills that are required.  While I'm new to pedal building, I'm not new to soldering, basic electronics, schematic reading, metal work, or even painting.  I've been doing that stuff with my job for the last 22 years.  Someone without those skills and experience is going to have a lot tougher time


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## peccary (Jul 3, 2021)

blackhatboojum said:


> Speaking for myself,  I got into building my own pedals to save money...



So did we all, friend. So did we all.



https://imgur.com/Jpi9CvA


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## Popnfreshbass (Jul 3, 2021)

AgAuthority said:


> Everybody needs a RAT in there life
> 
> Ag


A rat clone from byoc was my first build so I would recommend this as well. Not too complicated and a classic sounding pedal as a reward. I guess the only bump in the road would be the lm308,but you could just include the OP07.


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## Feral Feline (Jul 3, 2021)

Utility.

Everybody needs it, even if it isn't as sexy as a Freq'y Fuzz. Alas, anything deemed not sexy is not going to sell well. Yet, not everybody's into fuzz, and I've even come across people who proclaim to find overdrives to be boring.

A simple EQ, BMT... the "UnderDrive" .

Boost. Who doesn't need a boost once in a while?

An EQ Boost...


...


I fell asleep before being able to post the above, Cat woke me up for her breakfast and now there are all sorts of great suggestions!

While Fig has a point to limit options, I really liked Benny_Profane's Dist+/250 suggestion, 'cause the same board could also be used to build a MicroAmp. As JamieJ said.

VOL GAIN and a SWTC.

Lamma is another good'n, and again could add the SWTC, or an input cap blend as a "Tone" control. I think keeping tone simpler than a Muff's is a good idea — not that the Muff tone-stack is terribly complex, but just thinking parts count.



As much as I love fuzz, I don't think it's got enough broad appeal. I've got a friend who's been playing guitar for half a century and just this past year he finally asked me what fuzz he should get — he's NOT an anomaly; lotsa people just aren't into fuzz.
Mind, some people find ODs to be too bland.

RAT — been building for a few years (still a noob), but only recently built my first Rat. Again, not enough broad appeal, IMO.

Good points have been raised about the Vemuram Jan Ray and other expensive bootiki types that would draw in a noob.


Also suggested was a one-off exclusive to PedalPCB type circuit mashup — this would be great, but it still needs to have some connection to a famous hard-to-find expensive drawing card, ehr PCB... BJFE? Most of Björn's stuff is on a medium to high complexity level. ZVex Channel 2 w/ input blend-cap?


Rambly post, nuttin' new — 7am, Need coffee...


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## blackhatboojum (Jul 3, 2021)

Paradox916 said:


> How about the Guvernator? it’s not a crazy number of parts. All can be sourced from Tayda.. (not sure if that 9n6 cap is a deal breaker for requirement, just put a 10nf in there). It was one of my first builds and by far the easiest one to date... great sounding pedal that’s pretty versatile.... I’m not sure if it gets much more straightforward than that... just my two cents. Hope that helps.
> ​


I would agree with this one.  This was an easy build for me and the Marshall in a box pedals are pretty popular.  Maybe some more detailed and explanatory documentation would also help.


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## jjjimi84 (Jul 4, 2021)

Barry said:


> @jjjimi84 is all set up for video demo's





Robert said:


> This was my reasoning behind two or three knobs over one.
> 
> There would definitely need to be more detailed documentation than usual, this would be the one time I would cover the whole "This is how you snap the tab off a potentiometer" sort of topics.
> 
> I would _possibly_ want to commission someone to do a step-by-step video build as well.



I would do that shit for free and was already planning on it with the sandspur fuzz. I thought it was a good choice because it is an expensive, desirable pedal with low parts count that can all be purchased from tayda and deals with using a multimeter to bias the transistors. You can also get a predrilled enclosure but i was going to cover drilling.

As a side note there are two things you will never see or hear on my channel. 

1. Paid promotional or whatever that is. I only do what I want to do and I pay for it. If Robert (ppcb) or Kevin (aion) or Brian (mbp) asked me to do a video it would be because I truly respect these gentlemen and want nothing but good fortune for them. Plus they don’t need more dick jokes associated with their companies.

2. Please like and subscribe and hit that bell, never doing that. Not ever. If you like it watch it, if you don’t like it don’t watch it. I am going to be making videos until I run out of pedals and/or dick jokes and trust me, I have a ton of both.


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## Chuck D. Bones (Jul 4, 2021)

I recommend Timmy.  

Now what's this about Dick Jokes?


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## jjjimi84 (Jul 4, 2021)

Timmy was my second choice but love the idea of the jan ray as stated above.


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## jjjimi84 (Jul 4, 2021)

Chuck D. Bones said:


> I recommend Timmy.
> 
> Now what's this about Dick Jokes?



Whats the difference between my dick and my paycheck? My wife has no problem blowing the paycheck.

Hey oh


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## Chuck D. Bones (Jul 4, 2021)

benny_profane said:


> Why do most people get into building pedals in the first place? I think that should be the starting point. Fuzzes are big for people that are in it, but is that why most people begin in the first place?
> 
> I also think that this should be a PPCB original / essentially public domain circuit rather than a newer circuit.


Quarantine Fuzz!  An easy build, great tone and that one-of-a-kind board!!!


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## EGRENIER (Jul 4, 2021)

This is an interesting challenge…. Difficulty vs interest is the factor that needs to be balanced.

I started building recently and don’t consider myself even intermediate in electronics. I still can’t really read a schematic properly, though I can understand some of it.

IMHO parts count is not a big factor… yes it increases the chances of making a mistake, but if you can solder a resistor 10 times, I see no reason why you can’t do it 20 times.

If I look back at my “effects” journey, the first thing I wanted was distortion, but I got that from the amp I bought…. Then I wanted delay…. To me delay offered a realm of sound flexibility that no other pedal offers.  So after buying my first guitar and amp, I got an analog delay.

When I started building, I already had a Boss CE-3 and an Aria analog delay, so I went for a compressor and a Wah.  But my next build was a Seabed Delay.

In all honesty, its a fairly easy build and offers tons of possibilities… From what I remember, parts were easy to source….so that would be my suggestion.

On my first build, parts count was not a challenge. It was more the “collateral parts” not part of the build list that was more challenging.  Simple stuff like:

- Which way does the led goes ?
- Which way does the chip goes ?
- All the useful parts not on the BOM, such as chip sockets, led bezel, power input, 1/4 jacks, pots size and type, etc.

Key to instructions is not necessarily details, but clarity.  To me the PCB are so clear, that 20 pages of instruction would have frustrated me more than anything.

Also, each parts value/number needs to be labeled clearly.  Yes learning to read color code is useful, but really not necessary. Every build I have done so far consisted first in putting toget all the parts clearly labeled. This is how I start, and it has been very useful to reduce my mistakes.


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## fig (Jul 5, 2021)

This is (imo) a great idea btw. It removes a huge barrier to first-time builders, who being unsure that this will _light their fire, _may otherwise not pull that trigger due to uncertainty of sources, part numbers, values, packages, let alone much the pedal jargon that is used. 

We all know that once they've built that first pedal and posted a build report....


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## uranium_jones (Jul 5, 2021)

it's not the circuit that's the problem, it's knowing what to do with it. I think a beginner project could take something rather simple like a RAT and hold the end user's hand from buying the board to sourcing all the parts from Tayda. ESPECIALLY parts that might seem like what you want but aren't. Maybe even different wire gauge recommendations. I still don't know when I want to use stranded or solid half the time.


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## Robert (Jul 5, 2021)

EGRENIER said:


> IMHO parts count is not a big factor… yes it increases the chances of making a mistake, but if you can solder a resistor 10 times, I see no reason why you can’t do it 20 times.


I agree with this for the most part, there are exceptions of course. 

The low parts count was more for my own benefit to keep the labor involved in packing/labeling to a minimum.


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## PedalBuilder (Jul 5, 2021)

I’d recommend the Blue Breaker. It’s got a small parts list, doesn’t require any unobtainium components, and sounds great. Unlike, say, a TS808/TS9, relatively few people will already have one. And the Blues Breaker (and its derivatives) have some serious boutique cred.


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## Feral Feline (Jul 5, 2021)

If I can solder a resistor _incorrectly_ 10 times, I can surely do it 20 times. 

The more variables, the more likely an error can creep in.


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## Dali (Jul 5, 2021)

Feral Feline said:


> If I can solder a resistor _incorrectly_ 10 times, I can surely do it 20 times.
> 
> The more variables, the more likely an error can creep in.


At least you can't invert a resistor position. But being creative, you could put those 2 legs in a single hole!


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## Feral Feline (Jul 6, 2021)

Dali said:


> At least you can't invert a resistor position.


Whataya talkin' 'bout? I do it all the time! 😺

I don't think I've ever put both legs in one hole yet... 😸


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## Bobbyd67 (Jul 6, 2021)

The Lightspeed is real easy to build and sounds awesome, just a question of making a more beginner friendly build doc. All the parts are easy to source and you can even suggest other op amp than the opa2134 if the ic is too pricey for a first time builder, plus it would dip their toes into the swappable  single/dual/quad op amp world.

Any circuit with opamp and no bias to do would be best.


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## Barry (Jul 6, 2021)

I say throw them in the deep end, Thermionic Deluxe! sink or swim, they survive that build, drill the enclosure and do the graphics they can build anything! or maybe a TS or BB circuit


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## jjjimi84 (Jul 9, 2021)

Started filming yesterday, hopefully all of the footage turns out okay, going to finish up today and start editing..........


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## jjjimi84 (Jul 9, 2021)

thewintersoldier said:


> Make sure you start it mythbusters style and say failure is always an option lol. Because failure is part of the process. At all points, not just the beginning!



I forgot to solder a pot, trust me mistakes a plenty


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## mdc (Jul 9, 2021)

Do like a unity gain buffer with a 12 segment LED VU meter in a 1590a so you get really good at drilling on center and you get rad lights on your board.


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## Grubb (Jul 9, 2021)

I built a Muroidea first and apart from some crap hardware choices on my part (plastic Tayda DC jacks that won't tighten properly 😡) it went pretty smoothly. It's a classic pedal, appeals to high and medium gainers for different usages and was a straightforward build for someone who didn't really know what they were doing.

If you sell a kit, I'd put a link to the Basic Workflow Tips thread in the print materials, that guide got me through my first couple of builds and I still go back and re-read it regularly.


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## Untro (Jul 15, 2021)

I feel like the TS808, Rat, guvnator and BigMuffs are great offers as people have stated. Theyre totally what i started with too, and honestly recently ive been going back to just trying to really nail these builds after my dalliances with modulation/verb. But I also wonder if its a kind of separate business model that has its own growing pains. The idea of a prebuilt tayda cart and an accompanying video walk through for one of these pedals seems like a real organic solution as well, especially if it was collaborated by the community!


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