# Parentheses Octave and other issues.



## JetFixxxer

With Octave engaged I'm not getting the octave.   Also if I go full clockwise with the BLEND the output is lower.   

Is D6 suppose illuminate?


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## JetFixxxer

Also toggle switch in the middle and down sound the same.   Toggle switch up sounds different, but volume is low and have to use the boost.


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## DGWVI

Are your Germanium diodes backward?


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## JetFixxxer

DGWVI said:


> Are your Germanium diodes backward?


No, they are opposite polarity.


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## DGWVI

JetFixxxer said:


> No, they are opposite polarity.


Ah


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## K Pedals

DGWVI said:


> Ah


On the Russian diodes the stripe is on the anode (positive) instead of the cathode (negative)


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## JetFixxxer

I found D7 and D8 are bad.  Not sure why both of those went Tango Uniform.


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## JetFixxxer

Anyone have the schematic for this?


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## JetFixxxer

JetFixxxer said:


> Anyone have the schematic for this?



Swapped out D7 and D8 and they are still getting blown.  I'm getting flow both ways.   D4 and D5 are fine.

EDIT: Removed from the PCB they work normal.   Place them back into the PCB and signal flows both ways.


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## Nostradoomus

I’d stop messing with it until the schematics are available, that way you can really see what’s going on.


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## JetFixxxer

Nostradoomus said:


> I’d stop messing with it until the schematics are available, that way you can really see what’s going on.



I do need to stop messing with it until the schematic is posted. I might have messed the D7 trace up.  I also put the "clipping led" as suggested on the other thread.  Now when the toggle switch is selected down the volume drops, opposite of what it did.  Everything else seems to work except the Octave and not getting the different sounds from two out of the 3 position of the toggle switch.  Unless it's subtle..

I do like the sound I'm getting out of it, I wanted the octave portion of it. I have already 4 other fuzz on my pedal.


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## Robert

D7 and D8 are in parallel in opposite polarity so it's normal that they conduct like a diode in both directions.


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## JetFixxxer

Robert said:


> D7 and D8 are in parallel in opposite polarity so it's normal that they conduct like a diode in both directions.


Schematic?


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## Mothman

JetFixxxer said:


> Schematic?


+1


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## JetFixxxer

Might have received a bad batch of 10k resistors.   So far 4 of my 10k readings are all over the place.


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## zgrav

are you reading them after they have been soldered into your pcb?   and are the readings you are getting less than 10K?   the other parts on the PCB will often make it impossible to get an accurate reading for your resistance.


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## JetFixxxer

The 10k are being read while already soldered.  I'm not getting a steady reading.   I checked all the other resistors and those are good, when I measured R4 it was all over the place.  Checked R8 and R7 with same results. R9 was at 10k and haven't check any others.  Will when I get home.


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## zgrav

I would just go by the band colors on the resistors you have  already put on the board, at least as long as your resistance readings is the same or less than the value shown by the band colors.   When you measure on the board you are also getting the resistance on any other paths on the board between those two points so the measured resistance will be lower than shown on the bands.   your reading may also vary at first due to capacitors in those other circuit paths.


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## JetFixxxer

zgrav said:


> I would just go by the band colors on the resistors you have  already put on the board, at least as long as your resistance readings is the same or less than the value shown by the band colors.   When you measure on the board you are also getting the resistance on any other paths on the board between those two points so the measured resistance will be lower than shown on the bands.   your reading may also vary at first due to capacitors in those other circuit paths.



It varies, but never a constant (even after 2-3 minutes) and it's has only been on the 10k resistors.  I'm going check the others that I haven't installed to see.   Of course I'm going try to not mess with anything until I get a schematic, it will be difficult as it's in my nature to figure it out.


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## Nostradoomus

Desolder one side of the components you want to check...measuring them in circuit will never give you accurate readings


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## JetFixxxer

With Octave engaged I'm not getting the octave.   Also if I go full clockwise with the BLEND the output is lower.   

Is D6 suppose illuminate?


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## zgrav

I agree you should keep troubleshooting, but I would hold off trying to change those resistors if  the bands are the right colors and you are getting no more than 10K resistance on them when you check with your DMM.   (not surprising if  you get LESS resistance, as explained above)


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## Robert

There are even situations where you might read higher resistance in-circuit.  (Parallel capacitor with some residual charge)

It's not _impossible _of course, but the chances of a new resistor being far enough out of spec to cause a problem isn't extremely likely.
And more than one, in the same build?   I'd definitely eliminate every other possibility first.


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## JetFixxxer

Robert said:


> There are even situations where you might read higher resistance in-circuit.  (Parallel capacitor with some residual charge)
> 
> It's not _impossible _of course, but the chances of a new resistor being far enough out of spec to cause a problem isn't extremely likely.
> And more than one, in the same build?   I'd definitely eliminate every other possibility first.


 
Is it because of legal reasons the schematic wasn't included in the build docs?  When do you think it will be added if it's not?


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## Anotherpedalbuild

I had the same problem with the on/on/on diode selector. Middle and down were the same in tonality. I was using a different switch to the taiway brand specified in the build docs. I desoldered it, ordered the Taiway and made sure that the soldered joints on the diodes in the Rat clipping section were good. The ground sections are easy to get weak joints on due to the larger area the heat dissipates in (as opposed to a thin pcb track.) I use tiny copper heat sink clips off ebay to attach to the diode legs so that I can get a hot solder joint without burning out the diodes.

Please ignore any of this if you (Jetfixxxer) know this already!

Use a multimeter to double check resistors before soldering them to the pcb. Once soldered in, you can always use an app like electrodroid to check the resistor colour codes. I never trust the seller to send me what I ordered or mark the strip with the correct values.

Not sure about the octave issue. If the polarity is right, you can use a multi meter to check the fv of each diode. Also, to get the octave really good it is important to match the forward voltage of the diodes to get a matched pair.

Measuring resistors on the board is a problem, use the colour codes.

My main point is using the little copper clips (or tiny crocodile clips) whenever soldering in your diodes and transistors. Ge diodes want to blow, and socketing them can be trouble as they can crack easily even if the socket hole is right for the diode legs. I use jewellers round nose pliers when I bend diode legs, bending them roughly like you can with non glass types can damage them.

I apologise if these points sound basic, but I don't know how experienced you are as a builder. I've popped loads of lovely diodes in the past, and it's shameful!

Good luck with the Life pedal, it's superb to play.


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## zgrav

JetFixxxer said:


> Is it because of legal reasons the schematic wasn't included in the build docs?  When do you think it will be added if it's not?


It is not unusual for docs to get put up for new pedals without the schematics.  Sometimes the parts list will get published before the build documents, then the build documents, and then the schematic will be the last part that goes up.  They take more time to finalize, and there is more demand for the parts lists and build docs for the other new boards that are released at the same time.  All of the schematics eventually get published.    

The new board output on this site is crazy for what is a one-wizard operation.  Add in the time spent maintaining inventory, designing new stuff, testing new boards, updating web pages and shipping orders, and it is not surprising that the schematics usually get done later in the new build docs.


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## JetFixxxer

Anotherpedalbuild said:


> I had the same problem with the on/on/on diode selector. Middle and down were the same in tonality. I was using a different switch to the taiway brand specified in the build docs. I desoldered it, ordered the Taiway and made sure that the soldered joints on the diodes in the Rat clipping section were good. The ground sections are easy to get weak joints on due to the larger area the heat dissipates in (as opposed to a thin pcb track.) I use tiny copper heat sink clips off ebay to attach to the diode legs so that I can get a hot solder joint without burning out the diodes.
> 
> Please ignore any of this if you (Jetfixxxer) know this already!
> 
> Use a multimeter to double check resistors before soldering them to the pcb. Once soldered in, you can always use an app like electrodroid to check the resistor colour codes. I never trust the seller to send me what I ordered or mark the strip with the correct values.
> 
> Not sure about the octave issue. If the polarity is right, you can use a multi meter to check the fv of each diode. Also, to get the octave really good it is important to match the forward voltage of the diodes to get a matched pair.
> 
> Measuring resistors on the board is a problem, use the colour codes.
> 
> My main point is using the little copper clips (or tiny crocodile clips) whenever soldering in your diodes and transistors. Ge diodes want to blow, and socketing them can be trouble as they can crack easily even if the socket hole is right for the diode legs. I use jewellers round nose pliers when I bend diode legs, bending them roughly like you can with non glass types can damage them.
> 
> I apologise if these points sound basic, but I don't know how experienced you are as a builder. I've popped loads of lovely diodes in the past, and it's shameful!
> 
> Good luck with the Life pedal, it's superb to play.



Thank you for the input.  I'm a competent builder.  I can't tell you if I removed "X" value and put "Y" value in a circuit what effect that will have.

I ordered the toggle from Small Bear the one that was suggested on the parts list. I test the switch already and it's acting as it should.

If I order a bunch of resistors.  I usually spot check them and if a few check good I assume the rest are.


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## dubelectro

D6 LED silk is incorrect. If it is attached in the opposite direction, it will light up.


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## JetFixxxer

dubelectro said:


> D6 LED silk is incorrect. If it is attached in the opposite direction, it will light up.



Thanks.  

It was mentioned in the general question thread.  After reading that in the thread I positioned so the anode of the LED (D6) was soldered into the round hole marked "k" .  

I put my meter on "K" of D6 and go to enclosure I'm getting ground. Verified this with the other LED's (with switches engaged) all "K"s go to ground.  

I checked them with all 4 of my meters and one of those meters is analog.  2 out of the 4 meters are calibrated yearly.


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## Anotherpedalbuild

zgrav said:


> It is not unusual for docs to get put up for new pedals without the schematics.  Sometimes the parts list will get published before the build documents, then the build documents, and then the schematic will be the last part that goes up.  They take more time to finalize, and there is more demand for the parts lists and build docs for the other new boards that are released at the same time.  All of the schematics eventually get published.
> 
> The new board output on this site is crazy for what is a one-wizard operation.  Add in the time spent maintaining inventory, designing new stuff, testing new boards, updating web pages and shipping orders, and it is not surprising that the schematics usually get done later in the new build docs.


You're right. It is pretty mind blowing when you consider how many new pcbs are offered. I have no idea how pedalpcb HQ manages such a feat. I'm very grateful nevertheless.


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## JetFixxxer




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## JetFixxxer

?


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## zgrav

"??"


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## JetFixxxer

K of the LED D6 shouldn't be shorting out if the PCB is incorrectly marked. The "A" Should be.


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## zgrav

Is the main issue that you are not getting the octave on this build?  Or something besides that?  

I am sure you will be able to take a closer look at that part of the circuit after the schematic is posted.


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## JetFixxxer

Yes the main reason is the octave as this is the reason I wanted this PCB.


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## zgrav

FWIW,  maybe there is nothing wrong with your PCB.  I think I've seen other posts from folks suggesting the octave effect was more subtle than they thought it would be.  I haven't built this pedal and have not heard any samples of how it is supposed to sound with the octave turned on.  It looks like the two germanium diodes are the ones closest to the octave pot, and it may turn out that swapping those will give you more of an octave effect.  

What GE diodes did you used for D2 and D3?  You could check with an audio probe to see what is going through them when you have the octave part of the circuit engaged.  If nothing is going through them, then you can try to figure out what they should connect to on the board.  And if you are getting sound through them, you can use the audio probe to follow where it goes from the diodes to the blend control.

None of this is a substitute for having the schematic, but at least it gives you some other ideas of things to check in the meantime.


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## dubelectro

The terminal marked K is definitely GND. But it is correct to be marked A. 
Or you can change the direction of the two 1N4148 on the left side of the switch.

Germanium Diode seems to have a low Vf. 1N60 does not fit. I think 1n270 is good.


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